Skeptic Project

As a former member I can't see TZM as being a cult. Full of conspiracy theorists and pseudo science? Yes which is why I left because the membership structure was so loose and open as to let people with conflicting agenda's in. And as easy as it was to join it was just as easy to leave. It would actually serve TZM well to tighten up the rules as to who can join. Which coincidently would put it one step closer to being a cult (exerting more authority over it's members). But it really depends on the message. If TZM tightened up membership making it more exclusionary and even taking membership dues but focussed on science and the scientific method no one could really object to that and call that a cult as this type of organization is really no different than any other professional organization. Desteni, however, is becoming increasingly exclusionary requiring potential members to demonstrate their commitment before joining by posting videos, blogs and/shaving their head.

And let's address that act of head shaving. It immediately makes Desteni members recognizeable by sight. And it is an attempt of their members to resemble their bald leader. It is a surrender of power to their leader, a sign of submission and acceptance of the bizarre philosophy.

Billl stated that Desteni is a greater threat because their ideas are more realistic (i.e. Basic income). But cults are generally self-limiting because they at some point violate the threshold of believability (i.e. Reptiles, channeling Hitler) that normal people will not tolerate. In short their is a limited pool of gullible people for these cults to exploit. But that is not to say Desteni is not dangerous, it is certainly dangerous to it's members.

I agree with Billl insomuch as no investor would willingly invest with a group whose stared purpose is to make money obsolete. But you will have investors with people or groups who can take current products and make them more durable and efficient for the same or less cost.  Technological development has a powerful deflationary effect on prices.  So for Billl to say there exists no scientific basis for an RBE is misguided. There exists an entire financial concept called hedonics that attempts to quantify advancement and efficiency in regards to its impact on price, which hedonic adjustments invariably always lessen the impact of inflation.   In my view TZM as an entity need not exist as we are going to end up in the same place whether you pursue a free market, follow traditional capitalism or advocate a centrally planned economy.   All systems will pass GO and collect 200$.   Some systems will take longer than others is all.  Thus the argument of which vehicle we adopt going forward is irrelevant.  If Desteni wasn't in it for the money and control the idea of basic income grants would work too. 

Speaking more on money and subtle change. 25 years ago most stores took cash, credit was a bit of a hassle (mostly manual) and harder for the average person to get.  Fast forward and most financial transactions are debit or credit, processed electronically. I don't even  carry cash now.  Change happens subtly.  So you might have a hard time envisioning a moneyless society, 25 years ago people had a hard time envisioning a cashless society. 

TL;DR version

As long as your system doesn't qualify you for the loony bin, technology will smooth out what is wrong with your system until you finally figure out what is wrong and make it right. 

yup vasper needs to give his head a shake on this topic of RBE being scientific, its simply not at all.

Move to here if you want to discuss this point:
http://conspiracies.skepticproject.com/forums/topic/vasper-explain-how-an-rbe-is-possible-scientifically#post-44095

2012 CT
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I stopped reading when I read " So for Billl to say there exists no scientific basis for an RBE is misguided." You need to shake this TZM ideology...

POSTED 7 HOURS AGO #
 
Maybe that is your problem Billl, you don't read. My entire argument is not framed in TZM ideology. I don't require the collapse of capitalism and I don't need the abolishment of money. This is more technocracy than it is TZM.

^It's a conspiracy!  I am Peter Joseph.  Is my use of the phrase "going forward" too much like "moving forward"?  Did you not wear a helmet when you were a skateboarder?   You talk about dogma but do you ever read what you write?  I mostly read the phrase "terrible idea" and that is where your argument stops.  TZM has never done any primary research mostly I suspect because they don't have any real scientists. 

What I am talking about is making simple observations about how inflation is calculated from the CPI. Did you think I made up the term hedonics?  Here let me google that for you. 

http://tinyurl.com/5u3ohqx</p>

You said that the current capitalist system needs some reforms and not a complete rewrite and I agree.  Capitalism will be reformed. It will change subtly until it no longer resembles the Capitalism of today but it will probably still be called Capitalism and people will still be using money only not nearly as much and it will go much further than today. 

I managed to read a snippet from a book written in 1982 called Megatrends because I always get a kick out of what their predictions were and how they panned out.  First chapter was about how industrial society was going to completely transform into an information society.  The turning point, the author stated, for the US to go from an agricultural society to an industrial society occurred in 100 years. The turning point for knowledge workers to outnumber industrial workers happened in 20 years. Even in 1982 it was not about manufacturing and distributing material products, it was about manufacturing and distributing information. The question is what comes next? 

I'm necroing this thread because VTV linked to it on his shitty Facebook page.

VTV: Find where on the Rick Ross forum where I said TZM is a cult. IIRC I said it's not but needs to be watched more closely now that its shrinking, it's actions are moving into real life, and they are becoming more radicalized.

And VTV, don't say it was an ad-hom bash, you got called out on a lie is all and even then that term was only used by you.

Funny how you link this old thread instead of the Rick Ross thread because of how much of an ass you made of yourself and the thread is not locked, we're done. TZM is a mostly a benign cult of personality for Peter Joseph Merola and we all agree except for you.

Here's the link to see VTV make a fool of himself:
http://forum.rickross.com/read.php?12,97823