Skeptic Project

@Pendrokar:

You just mocked me for thinking you were on my side, when I never said that, the ZGM Admins ACCUSED YOU of that.

Alright, alright, I take that back, geez! I might have taken the phrase "There are spies everywhere" too seriously.

Oh I was quite *serious* about mocking the paranoia of the ZGM "admin" that thinks there are spies everywhere.

And you didnt answer my question:

Doesn't it bother you that your questions were deemed to be so unreasonable to them that they implied you were were a troll, one of us, only there to cause trouble? If you get upset with that and continue to ask difficult questions like you were doing, I guarantee THEY would ban you for breaking the rules and being what they class as a troll.

because for some reason you're still defending someone who lies.

Because he admitted his mistake in a PM:
"This is information I have gotten from others. ...<pointed that out>... Yes, I suppose I should have looked into the information and the claim like I normally do..."

Like he "normally does"? What a load of crap, Voice of Reason believes in what he wants to believe and just finds reasons why he can continue believing the things he wants to believe.

I would bet money that wasn't ever told anything of the sort by anyone, if he was he would surely say who they are and said we are lying or that they were lying. Instead he just accepts that we haven't banned any ZGM members simply because WE said so? That sounds very unlikely.

He wont post a retraction though or come here and defend himself. Look at how he said it, he said it as if it was a confirmed fact that he had some kind of experience in. There is literally no way you could possibly think we ban ZGM members for disagreeing. NO ZGM member has even been banned here! But Voice of Reason doesnt let that get in the way, he just makes things up and hopes no one checks. That may seem like stupid behaviour since its so easy to be caught, but from my dealings with him he really is that stupid and does that kind of thing all the time.

Just because someone sometimes lies, doesn't mean he always lies. All you do is point out.

You have to understand that I have dealt Voice of Reason before:

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=178882

So when I said I know that he knows its not just an honest "mistake" I'm going by his past behaviour. He made it up and just hoped no one would check.

I would recommended that thread as well to get an idea of the kinds of stupid arguments he uses, how dishonest he is and what my responses are to some standard ZGM arguments.

Would be nice if you could show where, if, you have expressed your concerns about TVP/RBE.

From that debate with VOR:

One of my very first threads was about [the Movement] and what relation the conspiracy theories had to it:
http://tinyurl.com/27v57g8</p>

I also extensively debated the direction Fresco had and is taking such as here.
http://tinyurl.com/2c3sd6c</p>

Notice how I was being civil - unlike Peter claims.

I had also defended the Venus Project for a while before I was banned and rejected the RBE completely, some points I made I do still agree with though:
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=156944&page=2&highlight=venus+project

But according to people like Peter I was just a troll only wanting to talk about 911. They know about this, they have been shown it before, but they ignore it. What a load of lying dishonest crap.

Doesn't it bother you that your questions were deemed to be so unreasonable to them that they implied you were were a troll, one of us, only there to cause trouble?

You want me to choose sides? TZM doesn't have "us agaisnt them" so neither do I. Emotional stances degrade credibility. Your hate against PJ increased more and more, so you get less and less credible.

he said it as if it was a confirmed fact that he had some kind of experience in.

I adressed that too. Like - 'You should have said "From what I heard...", then.' in that <pointed that out>

http://forums.randi.org

Great. But why do you think that PJ reads these forums and did you try to get yourself unbanned by providing this? I doubt it.

From the thread that links follow:

If Jacque needs money he can sell some of his designs.

No he can't, because his designs are based on his circular city design. If he made designs for individual use in modern day, engineers would ask for higher pay because way different building techniques and materials would be used.
Wait a minute. This is would be exactly the story that Ayn Rand wrote about in Fountainhead. Jacque Fresco could have been Roark! It didn't go well for Roark though. Ayn Rand saved Jacque! I gotta say this in TZM forum. I'll continue this later.

@Pendrokar:

Doesn't it bother you that your questions were deemed to be so unreasonable to them that they implied you were were a troll, one of us, only there to cause trouble?

You want me to choose sides? TZM doesn't have "us agaisnt them" so neither do I. Emotional stances degrade credibility. Your hate against PJ increased more and more, so you get less and less credible.

Jesus Christ would you stop pretending I'm saying something I didn't? Normally I would say its intentional but I have a feeling you just don't want to understand me.

I never said anything about "choosing sides". Im asking you if it BOTHERS YOU. Anyone might think your crazy reaction would just be an attempt to not answer the question. So I'll ask again, how do you feel about the fact that the ZGM admin thinks your questions are so unreasonable that they think are a troll, one of CS's members that has gone there to cause trouble?

DOES THAT NOT BOTHER YOU?

he said it as if it was a confirmed fact that he had some kind of experience in.

I adressed that too. Like - 'You should have said "From what I heard...", then.' in that <pointed that out>

You just repeated your previous point as if I never said anything, why didnt you listen to a single thing I said about that?

Why didnt you read my debate with Voice of Reason? Why did Voice of Reason so easily admit he was wrong if he felt he had real people that say they were banned?

http://forums.randi.org

Great. But why do you think that PJ reads these forums and did you try to get yourself unbanned by providing this? I doubt it.

He has been shown all this before, he even banned me in a thread I was being very civil but didnt ban the guy trolling me. Did that stop him from saying I wasnt civil in my criticisms? No. Peter banned be because he didnt want to deal with people pointing out all his lies and incompetence all the time.

Why did you ignore the threads I wrote ON THE ZGM forum? Oh yes, apparently you just want to find a reason to believe the lies of Voice of Reason and Peter.

And when he banned me, why would I want to go back? Before then I was defending them on this very forum because I didn't think they banned people for disagreeing. Also, I was not a member by that time and you HAVE to be a member to be on the forum as that is what the rules NOW are. If they find out you dont consider yourself a member that's it, you're gone. Why would I have gone back pleading to be let back into a crappy community like that?

If Jacque needs money he can sell some of his designs.

No he can't, because his designs are based on his circular city design.

Nonsense, he is always talking about designs that could be implemented outside of a city. Such as a hurricane protected safe buildings, or ideas to stop spread of malaria, or how to construct housing more efficiently, cars that are safer, etc

The problem is that people like Peter, if you remember in Addendum, claim that abundance and efficiency is not wanted in this economy which is total nonsense. Its the reason technological unemployment would be an issue in the first place. Fresco could have designed renewable energies of technologies won prizes and grants, they are out there all the time. But Fresco cant even get renewable energies in his own house! So either he is incompetent or pointless bothering with because after over half a decade he has accomplished nothing. All they want to do is "spread the news".

@Jumping on the BandwagED / Sil

Of course, Pendrokar is also an Ayn Rand fan.

Really? Now where did I say that? Even if true, why would that matter?
If I would read Hitler's Mein Kampf and the Talmud, what would I be then? A self-hating jew?

So Fresco is selfish like Howard Roark? I thought the Resource Based Economy was all about taking care of everyone.

@Sky

So Fresco is selfish like Howard Roark? I thought the Resource Based Economy was all about taking care of everyone.

If he(Howard) was really selfish, then he wouldn't care if his buildings would hold to save people that will go in, now would he. The idea was that he made buildings practical, not like high status buildings that have greek and roman columns for decorative reasons alone.

@Matt

Teenagers always think they have stumbled across some magical vault of truth when they discover Ayn Rand.

Two silly assumptions here Matt. Firstly how old I am? I won't wonder if you find it on the web.
Secondly. I didn't catch the idea of Ayn Rand and never finished reading Fountainhead, nor start on Atlas Shrugged, because TVP/RBE popped up during that time. We could say it would be by John Perkins term Corporatocracy with no government control like it was depicted in Bioshock video game.

@Pendrokar,

So wait, you're telling others to read a book you never finished?

Pendrokar said both the following statements

Please read Ayn Rand's Fountainhead or listen to an audiobook of it, then maybe you'll understand. Would you kindly?

Secondly. I didn't catch the idea of Ayn Rand and never finished reading Fountainhead, nor start on Atlas Shrugged, because TVP/RBE popped up during that time.

So here he is admitting to pushing a book/audio book forward to read and listen to even though he has never finished reading it.
Also he is admitting he is the kind of person to pretend to have knowledge in a subject and promote it without actually having done the full research and necessary reading.
Also he is admitting he is the type of person to drop what he is doing and jump ship to something else without completing what he was doing.

I will take from his admittance that not only has he no idea about Ayn Rand, but he has no idea about RBE either and is pushing both of them forward here.
Pendrokar probably spends more time taking hits from the bong and flip flopping his concentration onto different things than he does actually studying something through to the end.

All you have to do is read a book that Pendrokar never finished and all your questions will be answered.

"However since he has relayed the information to you I really find no reason to write some public statements in TZM forums or this blog in stating I was mistaken."

Ah, the Peter Merola version of accountability.

Sure, I'm wrong but hey who cares.

Just because someone makes an apology doesn't mean anyone has to accept it.

I feel like I'm talking to kids.

But then again, I probably am.

I'm tired of TVP. I wish Fresco would hurry up and croak so it would just go away.