Skeptic Project

"Its got more potentional now"

Potential for what?

"Perhaps on a personal note, VTV and I could compete to loose weight."

Just don't send your spouse to flip burgers while you sit at home on your butt and alls fine.

"To do some good in the world."

Who says the ideas ZM/TVP proposes are good in the first place?

"I seem to recal if you've got a job flipping burgers, you get free food!"

Most fast food companies don't feed their employees. They think it will cause employees to prepare extra food on purpose.

Either way, VTV is unemployed so it doesn't matter.

>> "I seem to recal if you've got a job flipping burgers, you get free food!"

My brother in law was fired from McDonald's from eating fries out of the garbage -- mind you not because he was eating out of the garbage, but because there's a policy of not eating any of the food, ever. I can't imagine other companies being any different.

Exactly, so why would Burger King be different and give VTV or Nanos tons of free food?

As it is evident that the mental maturity level here has sunk again even though I was trying to give constructive answers to the questions I am not going to waste my time here any further. This website can go back to being a place where you can't find any actual direct information about the Zeitgeist Movement.

@Ed

I answered you. I never ignored anything you said. I am tired of repeating myself until you get an answer you like. You broke my no insult rule when you said I don't know the meaning of the word lie. I do. Because you were doing it.

@Matt

For all your talk about supposedly being smarter then we are you act like a petulant child in need of a time out in the corner. To answer your question about becoming an "official spokesman" no one does not just appoint themselves. I spoke to Jacque and Roxanne in length about it while they were here in Michigan and was given that position. As for your theories about the situation economically here I will say that there are VERY educated people who are working at 7-11 here in Michigan right now as it is basically technological unemployment personified. I would be concerned that my wife works at Burger King if it were not for the fact that most people I know including those with College educations are living with their parents even in their thirties. Not because they are lazy or because they want to be by any means. But because there quite simply is nothing here. (Yes, I am sure your going to respond with "well move" but it's impossible to do that if you don't have money to do so in the first place.) If you look at the post that anticultist posted here earlier from me on the ZM you will get a chance to look at what the situation is like. Also, despite your further speculations that I am staying at home for being lazy, I supported this family as the main bread winner for three of the five years it has existed. When I was working my wife was staying at home. She asked me if she could be the one to work. We do not have family in the area to watch our kids and I would rather one of the parents was watching them anyway. So one of us staying at home is not a choice of laziness but one of necessity. I am sure you will respond with some arrogant insult spewed from the safety of your keyboard but that's alright. Every time you do that you prove me right about you.

@anti-cultist

I hope you eventually realize what a complete waste of your time your obsession with going after the Zeitgeist movement is. Your crusade is barely a blip in this situation and it is getting you laughed at. You are achieving nothing other then making a complete idiot out of yourself. All your work to "expose" Peter was a joke we still laugh about. I mean when you consider that you posted something that was supposed to create such a huge reaction, and then consider we didn't even bother to delete it because all it served to do was make you look like a complete idiot I would say that is a testament to this fact. Peter's interest in keeping his full name secret to protect his family is proven valid when idiots like you with no life set out to harass them. He does get death threats and it's not because he is "so important" it's because he touches on some things that obsessive nutjobs like you might react rashly to. You proved how incompetent you were in this sort of thing with your accusation that I worked at McDonalds. Then at Burger King, then it turns out it was my wife. (And again, this is not about me being unable to find a job. Or being reliant on my wife. Only one of us will be working at any given time because we have kids. I did it for three years and now she has for two. Maybe when you grow up and leave your home you might know a thing or two about this kid.) For someone who thinks highly of themselves for supposedly being a source of debunking you looked like a fool.

@Meurtos

You had some interesting points but you were kind of at the center of the "lets develop our own conspiracy theories about the Zeitgeist movement" hypocrisy I saw going on here.

@Danny

Your stupid little theories that you have done far more for the country then I ever did exposed. I helped organize the Revolution March on DC. I worked for countless hours on the Presidential campaigns of Ron Paul and Mike Gravel. I passed out far more fliers then you likely ever will and spent hours spreading the word of the "Patriot" movement then you likely ever will. I ran for Congress as a Libertarian and traveled extensively in pursuit of spreading the message. (No, I did not win. Never intended to. You don't run as a third party candidate expecting to win.) I stepped out of it because the United States is bullshit. It always was bullshit. Even the Constitution and the founding fathers still enabled slavery. Maybe someday when you grow up you will open your eyes. I found it absolutely ludicrously funny reading your "Ask me anything" thread where you got personally attacked for two full pages just to see you turn around and do the same thing.

@Edward

So long as you continue to allow people to pollute this forum with intellectual sludge nothing of value will ever be done here. Conversations about someone's weight, their job, their family life etc are best left to episodes of Jerry Springer. Good luck with your website. After perusing around to see how you guys treat each other here in other threads I was not participating in I can see this place is likely doomed to be a useless intellectual cesspool forever.

@All

I came here and did exactly what I intended to do. I had a little fun. I eventually offered to have a constructive dialogue to prove to you that we are willing to answer questions and the only rule I asked that you follow was that you keep things from being personal. The maturity level here was incapable of that. So that's the end of it. I got to humiliate anticultist for being the total incompetent he is and answer a few questions from a couple of constructive users. But the vast majority of what is contributed here is diatribe and trash. If you have constructive questions I will be happy to answer them. You can email me at VTV@V-RADIO.org.

This place like most internet forums with a clique of trolls showed all the same problems these communication mediums usually do. Un-moderated forums are havens for intellectual cowards and bullies who aren't big enough to bully people physically. Anticultist was utterly thrashed by me in debate and would just continue to declare he was winning the whole time even when he was made to look like an idiot. And while not all of you engaged in the personal attack you didn't protest it either. This makes you an enabler of that behavior and further discredits the forum as a whole.

Victory in internet debate is often about perception and the politics of that forum. It's like two kids in school who fight and the fight consists of one kid shoving the other. The "winner" in that social scheme will always be the one who was more "popular" and have little bearing on who actually got any physical advantage over the other. This is what anticultist is hoping for. That all of you will simply ignore his failures for the sake of maintaining the social structure here.

It also is completely dependent on the perception that people liking you or disliking you on a small forum is in any way indicative of anything relevant. Anticultist makes claims like "nobody cares" or "everyone hates you" because a couple of other people on a forum that is probably not even viewed by a hundred people agree with him. It's social ostracism and it is a total fallacy. This is why I kept pointing out that none of you had any power. I can stop posting here and never post here again and it will have no impact whatsoever on me personally. On my radio show, or the Zeitgeist Movement. You may reach a few people who are lo brow enough to value stuff like "Fatty" but you will never actually achieve anything. As was evidenced when a few people did post that they didn't agree with this behavior and were ignored. You lost credibility with the people who don't agree with this behavior. And many of them will never post about it in the first place. They will see that behavior and simply go somewhere else.

So to conclude. Don't delude yourself into believing that anything you said to me here personally ever had any effect on me personally. I have been at this a long time and this is little league compared to things I have been called in the past by cowards who when confronted in person oddly enough have nothing to say. I was never angry with anything you said. I was laughing the whole time. I was bored and spent some time playing with some of you to amuse myself. No more. No less.

Meanwhile, while people like anticultist will continue to delude themselves into thinking they "won" or "chased me off" they will still be living a pathetic lonely life and I will move on to more constructive uses of my time. You can convince yourselves you won some battle of signifigance here but the insignifigance will be clear enough when a week from now nothing of any real consequence will of happened because of any exchange here.

Like I said earlier. You may reach some other grammar school maturity idiots who think that calling someone "fat" is a valuable debate tactic but you have lost with anyone who is mature enough to realize how utterly juvenile and desperate that is. You can have the punk kids. I win the intellectuals.

I also find it incredibly dubious that for all of your talk about how bad baseless conspiracy theories are all I kept getting from you was more and more theories as to who I am. What is going on in my life, etc. that were all bullshit speculation. In claiming that the Zeitgeist Movement is supposedly invalid because of conspiracy theories you just kept making up theories of your own. It was actually really funny to watch and I doubt you realized it but it was the pinnacle of hypocrisy. Particularly when I revealed how absolutely wrong you were in your theories.

It's simply a matter of mind over matter.

I don't mind.

Because you don't matter.

@VTV You live in a permanent state of denial, you mentioned me so many times in your post just now, I almost feel turned on how important I am to you. I know exactly why you came here. It was to attempt to get into a debate with me, how special am I you actually made your way here just for me ? and you claim you won ? fuck me you are one deluded and creepy fat boy.

You still insist I posted on your forum which I did not, I have stated this twice now and you insist with your conspiracy theorist friends it was me, what the fuck is a sock puppet anyways ?

Your conspiracist leader hid his identity, it was prsented to me from a user here, I merely transcribed what was presented to show who your leader really was.
The fact you are attempting to make out like it was no big deal further proves how bad at lieing you all are. If it was no big deal the information would have been readily available prior to my presenting it, and me getting thousands of hits on the post would never of happened.
Likewise your leader would not of had to release his video after my post was made with the same title dealing with the same subject matter. Damage control.

Another amusing thing to note is your presence here, the fact you have taken so much of your time to attempt to make out like everything said is meaningless and we are of no consequence, further adds value to what we are saying. You are clearly affected enough by it and merely being here defending yourself and your movement has placed you into a situation you can't defend yourself from. You have given away that it does affect you and it does matter, because normalcy would dictate if it didnt matter you would of never been here in the first place.

Whether you want us to believe you are all laughing about it is completely dumb, because Peter shits his pants at the thought of people knowing who he is, he is scared for his life from some invisible boogey man. Now if you want to talk about funny thats the stuff right there, he literally thinks hes important enough to be a target for assassination attempts !

The fact that you can not even get a job and are reliant upon your wife, the fact you are a grown up leading a bunch of kids into a dead end societal trap, the fact you are a self appointed leader of a broken movement, it seems clear you are the dumb fuck here.

goodbye, good riddens, you wont be missed in the slightest

oh and just a word to wise 'you will see the same people on your way back down' now fuck off

6 times he mentioned me in his post, I think that classes as an obsession folks. creepy stuff

> Who says the ideas ZM/TVP proposes are
> good in the first place?

Well, I think using the scientific process to change to better solutions is the way to go.

> Either way, VTV is unemployed so it
> doesn't matter.

Saves on the bills if they only have to pay for one to eat.

Its the RBE way to do without money..

> I have to disagree that TVP will do
> some good in the world.

I only said it had potentional..

> Jacque and Roxanne are incapable of
> letting go and allowing it to evolve

Quite possibly, but thats rather hard to tell without them discussing things with us. (Especially Fresco who we hardly ever seem to directly chat with, and when folk do, they are so weak willed when he doesn't answer their question, come on folk, push the point!)

> Peter is too static and rigid

Agreed.

> but the movement itself is simply a
> failure right now, and as far as I can
> see unless something radical changes
> its going to be an outright failure.

Agreed, though there is always hope, especially the recent glimar over their home energy project.

> why would Burger King be different and
> give VTV or Nanos tons of free food?

I do remember reading not so long ago about either them or McDonalds giving free meals to employees. (It was especially mentioned as one of their employees had worked there for decades and every day had 3 meals for free.)

Its quite possible that with the credit crunch nowdays, that many companies that used to do this, have tightened their belts and now stop the practice. (I remember a sweet factory that let all of its employees eat as many sweets as they like, they just couldn't take any home with them.)

> You're gonna get kicked out of the
> movement lol.

You know when I was PR guy for NET, I believe someone complained about me calling people names (I think I called someone an idiot..), which contributed to me being removed from my position. (I always thought that was a bit heavy handed, after all, shouldn't I be able to act just like VTV when necessary?)

Oh well that was a shame, I was hoping he would answer some questions, bit of a missed oppertunity there me thinks.

Does this service show you how many people viewed the posts, or not ?

I guess VTV is hoping I make a blog post about him from all of this, but to be honest hes of little importance to their movement therefore not important enough to discuss about to my readers.

I am almost certain that it would get little attention and interest other than agreement on how much of a dipshit he is. So I am content to leave this hilarity here as an epitath to the time a nobody from the venus project came through and acted important.

VTV, don't let the door hit your big ass on the way out!

To be honest I perceive anticultist to be a very intelligent person. I have no clue what VTV is talking about I can't believe he makes fun of someone for his amusement is pretty sickening in my perspective. Yes we know that VTV is fat but to be honest that is not of importance, sure VTV claims to get laid on these forums and again that doesn't provide any importance, VTV you bring these things to the forum; I do not recall anybody asking you if you got laid.

Since you bring your family into these forums and the fact that you got laid my question would be are you really married? I know on your myspace it says your married but on your wifes myspace she says she's in a relationship and at that she is a bisexual. She doesn't have any picture on her myspace of you with her and she doesn't even take on your last name of Kiernan which supports even more that you two are not legally married. My interpretation of this would mean that you two are not in a legally binding marriage relationship but more like a mutual agreement, it may also mean that she is under the perception that it is a open relationship meaning a man or a women could sleep with her even start another relationship on the side. Technically Grits could go over and bang your wife and everything would be A-Okay.

At that VTV says himself he's not even trying to look for a job and his excuse is the kids. Please do not hide behind the kids as a excuse I see this many times with teacher unions and things of that nature that's not an excuse but your failure and laziness to get a job. I know many single mothers that have a job, go to college and raise a kid so please don't give people that excuse just come out and say it your to lazy, not skilled enough to get a good job so your going to continue to leech off your surgarmomma, until she realizes that your nothing more than a fat pulsing zit that does absolutely nothing and needs to be popped.

Not to compare you to me but I'm 23 years old I graduated college, I'm now going to medical school. I'm a busy boy, and by the time I'm 30 I'll be graduated and onto bigger and better things and what will you be doing 7 years down the line? Anything close to what I'm doing, I doubt it, you'll still be apart of a movement that essentially doesn't move, does nothing, is nothing, please prove not just me but what everyone else thinks about your movement is wrong, please do so... All the zeitgeist has is a crapshoot of dreams, I'm not saying dreams are bad but they certainly are not reality their dreams and nothing more you give people false hope and when they realize that's all that these projects can give them don't be surprised when you have a lot of pissed off people or as you would define them type 3 trolls on your hands LOL.

What kind of role model are you not only for the community your involved in but towards your own children. A man who doesn't work, refuses to get a job to support his family and hides behind his kids and uses them as an excuse... Excuse are like assholes everyones has got one and each one of them stink...

You blame other people for your problems even your own children. When people disagree with you you point the finger back and since your in a position of power they are labeled and believed to be a troll. How about you take one long damn look at yourself in a mirror. You believe in fantasy stuff like UFO's and Aliens and wiccan, and yet don't support people in their own beliefs going to leaps and bounds to say their wrong without any consideration ahh of course of they believe in Aliens and UFO"s which is of your belief then it's perfectly fine... You need to take one look at yourself in the mirror and see that you are in fact the problem. Their is no such thing as a troll unless it's under a damn bridge.

You get off at making fun of people, that's more than likely because you hate yourself who you are. When you say the Untied States it's fucked up, it's because you hate yourself and who you are. When you define and label people as trolls then use that power to blow people out of the water that disagree with yourself, you hate yourself and who you are... When you eventually look in the mirror and look at yourself, you hate yourself and who you are. You wish you could solve problem, you wish you were that knight who slayed the dragon (like in your myspace pictures), you imagine you are but you are not. You think your doing good but still do acts of evil, your no good as a individual.

You need to look into that mirror and hate yourself for the right reason then ask yourself how can I change, how can i do better, what can i do to help humanity, more action or more masturbation and talk... Ask the hard question about yourself, who you are, where you want to go, know and do. What damage can i give towards societal norms that are the RIGHT things to do, and what things do i not like about myself that i want to change. I want to walk the walk not talk the talk, I want to build something, do something, experiment and see what happens, that's what everybody should be doing. When you asks the question you will accept change until then your a walking fat pus of zit that will eventually unwillingly pop...

of course it''s not your fault society made you that way, or maybe just maybe you made yourself that way. You had the kid, now you hdie behind it. SHAME ON YOU LOSER! be a real man, get a job! Your 34 years old... COME ON!

@Meurtos

You had some interesting points but you were kind of at the center of the "lets develop our own conspiracy theories about the Zeitgeist movement" hypocrisy I saw going on here.

Not sure exactly what "conspiracy theories" I am supposed to have spun here. Did anyone else catch on to what he supposedly means? I merely said that I suspected VTV was a Truther and repeated my usual thing that ZM actively promotes conspiracy theories and their protestations to the contrary are bullshit, which anybody who pays any attention to what I've said on this forum (or has read my blog) would know is my #1 complaint with the ZM.

Nonetheless, it is true that flustered conspiracy theorists will often accuse skeptics of themselves being conspiracy theorists...such as when Brad270 accused me of buying into Al Gore's nefarious global warming sham, or when 9/11 Truthers in general start throwing around terms like "Official Conspiracy Theory" and get into shit like "a bunch of guys armed with box-cutters who live in caves." That smacks of the old Pee Wee Herman comeback, "I know you are, but what am I?"

Normally wouldn't waste the magnetic ink on this reply, but as it seems the ZM is carefully monitoring what we say here on Conspiracyscience, I figure VTV and/or Peter Merola will read this eventually.

Thanks Matt, missed that little quote.

It was pretty obvious he was a Truther. When I was badgering him about it (evidently one of the "conspiracy theories" I was spinning) the easiest thing in the world for him to do would have been to deny he was a Truther--if in reality he wasn't. The fact that he tried to confuse the issue by downplaying the relevance of 9/11 issues to the ZM is another dead giveaway.

That's why the ZM members can shriek all they want about conspiracy theories ruining the movement and nothing will change. The people in control are conspiracy theorists.

And hence the reason we criticize them on this forum. If Peter Merola hadn't made that ridiculous conspiracy film I really wouldn't give a shit about Jacque Fresco or the Venus Project. But we have a movement run by a 9/11 Truther, whose chief propagandist is a 9/11 Truther, both of whom claim the fact that they believe in 9/11 truth is irrelevant to what they stand for.

I challenge anyone to find any movement or organization anywhere on this planet that has 9/11 Truthers in not one but TWO of their highest offices and which does not have as one of its main objectives promotion or support of conspiracy theories.

> Cool, let me know when you find some scientists.

You don't necessarly need scientists to use the scientific process when it comes to problem solving.

This rather puts it over in a nice way. (Just ignore the bit about biology.)

http://www.biology.iupui.edu/biocourses/n100/2k4scimethnotes.html</p>

> Nah, there's no hope. Fresco will be dead soon.

We'll see. (I had rather given up hope myself before.)

He might well live another 20 years, either way sadly he doesn't give enough input these days to really push things along. (I used to hope he would show up in the forums and help us all with techical design issues.)

> Who will take his place?

In theory no one needs to take his place, we could just work in some kind of group effort. (Much like we are now..)

> Your movement is toast, man.

Its not my movement, I've one of my own :-)

I'm just trying to help out as best I can, give advice, try and help stop it making the same mistakes I've seen others make.

If Fresco dies now, it'll be a conspiracy, and you know it.